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image scale (2.2) - missing print size

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image scale (2.2) - missing print size Eric Pierce 06 Nov 10:14
  image scale (2.2) - missing print size Sven Neumann 06 Nov 12:56
  image scale (2.2) - missing print size Sven Neumann 06 Nov 13:03
   image scale (2.2) - missing print size Richard Taylor 06 Nov 19:32
   image scale (2.2) - missing print size Eric Pierce 06 Nov 21:31
    image scale (2.2) - missing print size Sven Neumann 08 Nov 12:48
     image scale (2.2) - missing print size Joao S. O. Bueno Calligaris 08 Nov 13:35
     image scale (2.2) - missing print size Nonexistent Entity 08 Nov 15:45
      image scale (2.2) - missing print size Sven Neumann 08 Nov 16:54
      image scale (2.2) - missing print size Joao S. O. Bueno Calligaris 08 Nov 17:21
     image scale (2.2) - missing print size Eric Pierce 09 Nov 03:11
      image scale (2.2) - missing print size Sven Neumann 09 Nov 15:13
       image scale (2.2) - missing print size Eric Pierce 10 Nov 01:29
        image scale (2.2) - missing print size Sven Neumann 10 Nov 02:14
         image scale (2.2) - missing print size Eric Pierce 10 Nov 02:57
      image scale (2.2) - missing print size Jakub Friedl (lists) 09 Nov 20:50
image scale (2.2) - missing print size William Skaggs 09 Nov 18:01
  image scale (2.2) - missing print size Michael Schumacher 09 Nov 18:10
  image scale (2.2) - missing print size Eric Pierce 10 Nov 01:44
Eric Pierce
2004-11-06 10:14:57 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Will the 'print size width/height' fields be returning to the Scale Image dialog?

Forgive me if I've misinterpreted the intentions of the new Scale Image dialog (and let me know if I have), but after reading bug #151022, I believe the removal of the 'Print size Width/Height' fields unnesessarily adds an extra step for people in the print industry (me) who rely on changing an image to a specific print size w/o any harm to the pixels.

The previous Scale Image dialog worked perfectly for "resizing" images for print. Now, with the 2.2pre1 image scale, if I have an image that is 5" x 5" / 150 ppi (750 px by 750 px) and I need to (non-destructively) change the print size to 4" x 4", the only way to do this with the new dialog is to pull out a calculator. I must divide 750 (px) by 4 (inches) to determine the new print resolution (which comes to 187.5 ppi), and enter this value in for the x/y resolution.

With the older dialog, since all I'm concerned with is changing the print image size to 4" x 4", I had a dedicated field ('Print size Width/Height') to simply enter that info into. I didn't have to worry about the resolution as it calculated automatically thus preserving (i.e., not changing) the image pixel size.

Also, before anyone suggests this, I did try changing the image size units to inches and then change the size that way, but it becomes a destructive scale.

Personally, I will continue happily using the Gimp regardless if this gets fixed or not, but I do think people coming from a print background who are new to the Gimp will be confused by this (i.e., having to manually calculate the resolution to change the print size).

Thanks for reading, Eric Pierce

Sven Neumann
2004-11-06 12:56:04 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Hi,

Eric Pierce writes:

Will the 'print size width/height' fields be returning to the Scale Image dialog?

Uh, oh. The new dialog has been proposed here months ago. Why didn't anyone complain earlier? We are in string and UI freeze now :( That said, we could of course still do changes but I find it very disappointing that these issues come up so late.

Sven

Sven Neumann
2004-11-06 13:03:52 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Hi,

Eric Pierce writes:

Will the 'print size width/height' fields be returning to the Scale Image dialog?

Would it perhaps be better to also remove the Resolution entries from the Scale dialog and add a new dialog Image->Change Print Size ? The fact that you had to use the Scale dialog for changing the resolution has always been a source of confusion. Perhaps a different dialog would be a good way to solve that problem w/o ending up with a cluttered Scale dialog again?

Sven

Richard Taylor
2004-11-06 19:32:18 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

On Saturday 06 Nov 2004 12:03, Sven Neumann wrote:

Hi,

Eric Pierce writes:

Will the 'print size width/height' fields be returning to the Scale Image dialog?

Would it perhaps be better to also remove the Resolution entries from the Scale dialog and add a new dialog Image->Change Print Size ? The fact that you had to use the Scale dialog for changing the resolution has always been a source of confusion. Perhaps a different dialog would be a good way to solve that problem w/o ending up with a cluttered Scale dialog again?

That would make sense to me. I always found the scale dialog confusing.

Richard

Eric Pierce
2004-11-06 21:31:49 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

On Sat, Nov 06, 2004 at 01:03:52PM +0100, Sven Neumann wrote:

Hi,

Eric Pierce writes:

Will the 'print size width/height' fields be returning to the Scale Image dialog?

Would it perhaps be better to also remove the Resolution entries from the Scale dialog and add a new dialog Image->Change Print Size ? The fact that you had to use the Scale dialog for changing the resolution has always been a source of confusion. Perhaps a different dialog would be a good way to solve that problem w/o ending up with a cluttered Scale dialog again?

Sure. That actually makes the most sense.

Eric

Sven Neumann
2004-11-08 12:48:44 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Hi,

we spent some more thoughts on this and discussed the topic on #gimp. Let me present the current plan and ask you for comments. I'd like to get it right this time since we should try to avoid further string changes before 2.2.0...

So the plan is to keep the Scale Image dialog as is and to add a new dialog called "Print Size" which will allow to change the image resolution (and nothing else). It should offer two entries to specify the print size in physical units and two entries to specify the print resolution (linked with a chain-button since you will usually want to change both values at the same time).

Does that make any sense? Is "Print Size" a good name for the dialog and it's menu entry?

Sven

Joao S. O. Bueno Calligaris
2004-11-08 13:35:12 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

On Monday 08 November 2004 09:48, Sven Neumann wrote:

Hi,

we spent some more thoughts on this and discussed the topic on #gimp. Let me present the current plan and ask you for comments. I'd like to get it right this time since we should try to avoid further string changes before 2.2.0...

So the plan is to keep the Scale Image dialog as is and to add a new dialog called "Print Size" which will allow to change the image resolution (and nothing else). It should offer two entries to specify the print size in physical units and two entries to specify the print resolution (linked with a chain-button since you will usually want to change both values at the same time).

Does that make any sense? Is "Print Size" a good name for the dialog and it's menu entry?

Seems ok for me.
JS
->

Sven

Nonexistent Entity
2004-11-08 15:45:18 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Hi,

On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 12:48:44 +0100, Sven Neumann wrote:

Does that make any sense? Is "Print Size" a good name for the dialog and it's menu entry?

That'd be logical, It'd probably be nice located under File menu closer to other print options.

Sven Neumann
2004-11-08 16:54:54 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Hi,

"Nonexistent Entity" writes:

Does that make any sense? Is "Print Size" a good name for the dialog and it's menu entry?

That'd be logical, It'd probably be nice located under File menu closer to other print options.

Since it's not a file operation, it would not be very logical to put it there. IMHO it should be located in the Image menu close to "Scale Image" and "Canvas Size".

Sven

Joao S. O. Bueno Calligaris
2004-11-08 17:21:12 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

On Monday 08 November 2004 12:45, Nonexistent Entity wrote:

Hi,

On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 12:48:44 +0100, Sven Neumann

wrote:

Does that make any sense? Is "Print Size" a good name for the dialog and it's menu entry?

That'd be logical, It'd probably be nice located under File menu closer to other print options.

I'd prefer it to stay in the image menu, next to "canvas size" and "resize image".
It's image data that'd be changed after all.

Eric Pierce
2004-11-09 03:11:59 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

So you'll also be moving Resolution from Scale Image, correct?

For what it's worth, I did a good 2 minutes of research on this topic to see what the other softies are doing for a "Print Size" type dialog.

Here: http://epierce.freeshell.org/gimp/print_size_research_results.php

I see good arguements for two 'print size/resolution' location ideas.

#1 Returning it as it was in d be curious to hear from others on this topic who use Gimp mostly for print work.

Eric P.

On Mon, Nov 08, 2004 at 12:48:44PM +0100, Sven Neumann wrote:

Hi,

we spent some more thoughts on this and discussed the topic on #gimp. Let me present the current plan and ask you for comments. I'd like to get it right this time since we should try to avoid further string changes before 2.2.0...

So the plan is to keep the Scale Image dialog as is and to add a new dialog called "Print Size" which will allow to change the image resolution (and nothing else). It should offer two entries to specify the print size in physical units and two entries to specify the print resolution (linked with a chain-button since you will usually want to change both values at the same time).

Does that make any sense? Is "Print Size" a good name for the dialog and it's menu entry?

Sven

Sven Neumann
2004-11-09 15:13:12 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Hi,

Eric Pierce writes:

So you'll also be moving Resolution from Scale Image, correct?

No. The resolution entries would stay in the Scale Image dialog. I said the plan was to not change the Scale Image dialog at all and add an additional dialog to set the Print Size.

Sven

William Skaggs
2004-11-09 18:01:53 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

For consistency with other programs and with users' expectations, the menu entry should probably be called "Print Setup" and should go into the File menu next to the "Print" entry.

-- Bill

______________ ______________ ______________ ______________ Sent via the KillerWebMail system at primate.ucdavis.edu

Michael Schumacher
2004-11-09 18:10:22 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

William Skaggs wrote:

For consistency with other programs and with users' expectations, the menu entry should probably be called "Print Setup" and should go into the File menu next to the "Print" entry.

But this "Setup" doesn't offer margins, the orientation of thei mage on a sheet, printer settings etc... all the things users will expect from something that is called "Print Setup".

HTH, Michael

Jakub Friedl (lists)
2004-11-09 20:50:30 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

#2 Putting it into its own menu entry (Sven's idea below) because...

I vote for the #2.

Eric Pierce
2004-11-10 01:29:24 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Would this new 'Print Size' dialog have its own 'Resolution' setting?

Eric P.

On Tue, Nov 09, 2004 at 03:13:12PM +0100, Sven Neumann wrote:

Hi,

Eric Pierce writes:

So you'll also be moving Resolution from Scale Image, correct?

No. The resolution entries would stay in the Scale Image dialog. I said the plan was to not change the Scale Image dialog at all and add an additional dialog to set the Print Size.

Sven

Eric Pierce
2004-11-10 01:44:06 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

That may be the case in DTP (Desktop Pub.) programs, but not in bitmap/raster editors.

See my updated 3 minute look at 'Image Resize' dialogs of 3 other raster editor wanna-bes. http://epierce.freeshell.org/gimp/print_size_research_results.php

Eric P. On Tue, Nov 09, 2004 at 09:01:53AM -0800, William Skaggs wrote:

For consistency with other programs and with users' expectations, the menu entry should probably be called "Print Setup" and should go into the File menu next to the "Print" entry.

-- Bill

______________ ______________ ______________ ______________ Sent via the KillerWebMail system at primate.ucdavis.edu

Sven Neumann
2004-11-10 02:14:08 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Hi,

Eric Pierce writes:

Would this new 'Print Size' dialog have its own 'Resolution' setting?

Am I really that bad at describing things? The only thing you can configure in "Print Size" would be the resolution. There would be two entries to set the resolution (horziontal and vertical) and two entries to choose the print dimensions (width and height). Changing the print width or height will only affect the resolution, nothing else.

Sven

Eric Pierce
2004-11-10 02:57:00 UTC (over 19 years ago)

image scale (2.2) - missing print size

Ulp... my mistake.

You laid it out perfectly in your initial email. I just lost it somewhere in the thread. On Wed, Nov 10, 2004 at 02:14:08AM +0100, Sven Neumann wrote:

Hi,

Eric Pierce writes:

Would this new 'Print Size' dialog have its own 'Resolution' setting?

Am I really that bad at describing things? The only thing you can configure in "Print Size" would be the resolution. There would be two entries to set the resolution (horziontal and vertical) and two entries to choose the print dimensions (width and height). Changing the print width or height will only affect the resolution, nothing else.

Sven