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Problems with brushes

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Problems with brushes Anke Lange 20 May 12:48
  Problems with brushes Olivier 20 May 13:09
   Problems with brushes Richard Gitschlag 20 May 17:16
    Problems with brushes Martin Renold 21 May 18:12
     Problems with brushes Richard Gitschlag 22 May 15:59
   Problems with brushes Anke Lange 20 May 19:29
Anke Lange
2012-05-20 12:48:51 UTC (almost 2 years ago)

Problems with brushes

Hello list

I'm having a closer look at the use of brushes and I came across a few things, that were easy to use in the previous gimp (2.6) and now they are not there anymore. And some of the new features don't seem to work for me. So are they a features or bugs? Well, I just make a little list ;)

1. Why don't the brushes show their real size when aktivated? The tool seems to adopt the settings of the previous used brush.

2. How can I paint adopting the gradiant for brush-colors? When using brush-dynamics random-color, it does use the gradient-color, but not in the correct sequence.

3. Using brushes with a minimum distance of 1 lieves a gap using a brush caligraphic-brush with an angle of 40%.

4. The mapping matrix for the dynamic settings of the bushes is not editable. How can I edit this map to use on my own brushes?

5. When making a grayscale gih-brush, it doesn't display adopt the setting-procedures
Like when you create a brush to write GIMP using 5 layers. G, I, M, P, empty. Settings: ranks 5 random.

Using the brush, doesn't display the word GIMP , It just jumbles it all up so something like GMMGGIP PPII comes out of it.

6. The Gimp Tool Options "Smooth stroke" and "Incremental" don't show any affect on the stroke of any brush. Do they only effect brushes using a tablet?

It would be great if you could give me a hint on what I do wrong. Mayby it is a problem with my system (Xubuntu 12.4) I used the packages to compile gimp, shortly after you annouced it.

Thanks a lot for having a look.

Anke

Anke Lange
An der Landwehr 25
49076 Osnabrck
Telefon 0541 6004299
gimp-werkstatt@gmx.de

www.kreativ-workshops.net
www.gimp-werkstatt.de
www.kompozer-web.de

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Olivier
2012-05-20 13:09:18 UTC (almost 2 years ago)

Problems with brushes

2012/5/20 Anke Lange :

Hello list

I'm having a closer look at the use of brushes and I came across a few things, that were easy to use in the previous gimp (2.6) and now they are not there anymore. And some of the new features don't seem to work for me. So are they a features or bugs? Well, I just make a little list ;)

1. Why don't the brushes show their real size when aktivated? The tool seems to adopt the settings of the previous used brush.

The size of the brush is set by the Size setting in the options of the painting tool you use. Thus a brush no longer has only one intrinsic size.

2. How can I paint adopting the gradiant for brush-colors? When using brush-dynamics random-color, it does use the gradient-color, but not in the correct sequence.

It uses it in a random sequence! If you want to use the gradient in a non-random way, define a new paint dynamics, and check a box in the Color line of its Mapping matrix, for example Pressure or Direction.

3. Using brushes with a minimum distance of 1 lieves a gap using a brush caligraphic-brush with an angle of 40%.

Don't understand what you're telling. What painting tool and what exact brush are you using?

4. The mapping matrix for the dynamic settings of the bushes is not editable. How can I edit this map to use on my own brushes?

You have to define a new paint dynamics. Use the second or third button in the bottom of the Paint Dynamics dockable dialog.

5. When making a grayscale gih-brush, it doesn't display adopt the setting-procedures
Like when you create a brush to write GIMP using 5 layers. G, I, M, P, empty. Settings: ranks 5 random.

Using the brush, doesn't display the word GIMP , It just jumbles it all up so something like GMMGGIP PPII comes out of it.

Because you are asking for randomness.

6. The Gimp Tool Options "Smooth stroke" and "Incremental" don't show any affect on the stroke of any brush. Do they only effect brushes using a tablet?

Set the opacity of your brush to 50%, and try it with or without "Incremental" to see what it means.

For "Smooth stroke" try the Paintbrush tool with the Block 01 brush, set the options of Smoot stroke to their maximum, and try with or without checking the option.

It would be great if you could give me a hint on what I do wrong. Mayby it is a problem with my system (Xubuntu 12.4) I used the packages to compile gimp, shortly after you annouced it.

Your distribution or installation is not important, but these features are new.

Olivier Lecarme
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Richard Gitschlag
2012-05-20 17:16:01 UTC (almost 2 years ago)

Problems with brushes

From: olecarme@gmail.com
Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 15:09:18 +0200 To: gimp-werkstatt@gmx.de
CC: gimp-developer-list@gnome.org
Subject: Re: [Gimp-developer] Problems with brushes

4. The mapping matrix for the dynamic settings of the bushes is not editable. How can I edit this map to use on my own brushes?

You have to define a new paint dynamics. Use the second or third button in the bottom of the Paint Dynamics dockable dialog.

This is the biggest problem with making Brush Dynamics their own resource type, and from the end user's perspective, an unwanted regression compared to how 2.4 through 2.6 allowed you to edit the mapping matrix at any time. It's like if you went to the Curves dialog and loading a preset means you can't make further adjustments to fine-tune the graph.

In the meantime, make sure you have created one New brush dynamics resource even if it's solely for the ability to edit the matrix.

6. The Gimp Tool Options "Smooth stroke" and "Incremental" don't show any affect on the stroke of any brush. Do they only effect brushes using a tablet?

Set the opacity of your brush to 50%, and try it with or without "Incremental" to see what it means.

"Incremental" means that every application of paint in a stroke layers on top of the previous one. I recommend never using it outside special cases - most brushes have a spacing of 10-15% or so which means that any given pixel along the stroke area will end up 'painted' up to 5-7 times over. Normally this is a moot point but with incremental option this means that the opacity will end up being applied 5-7 times over too -- you lose the ability to get a stroke with a predictable OVERALL opacity value (even an opacity setting of 10%, if incremental, yields an end result up to 40-50% opacity). This is as technically correct as it is utterly undesirable, but it's a limitation in how GIMP handles painting actions internally so it's virtually impossible to fix.

-- Stratadrake strata_ranger@hotmail.com
--------------------
Numbers may not lie, but neither do they tell the whole truth.

Anke Lange
2012-05-20 19:29:39 UTC (almost 2 years ago)

Problems with brushes

Hallo Olivier

thanks for your fast response :)

Am 20.05.2012 15:09, schrieb Olivier:

2012/5/20 Anke Lange:

1. Why don't the brushes show their real size when aktivated? The tool seems to adopt the settings of the previous used brush.

The size of the brush is set by the Size setting in the options of the painting tool you use. Thus a brush no longer has only one intrinsic size.

This is not very handy, because brushes made from pixelgrafics don't look very nice anymore, when they are scaled bigger. And why should you make brushes in a special size, if it doesn't matter in anyway? Ok, I will get used to putting a brush back to it's original size, but it really isn't very handy.

2. How can I paint adopting the gradiant for brush-colors? When using brush-dynamics random-color, it does use the gradient-color, but not in the correct sequence.

It uses it in a random sequence! If you want to use the gradient in a non-random way, define a new paint dynamics, and check a box in the Color line of its Mapping matrix, for example Pressure or Direction.

3. Using brushes with a minimum distance of 1 lieves a gap using a brush caligraphic-brush with an angle of 40%. Don't understand what you're telling. What painting tool and what exact brush are you using?

4. The mapping matrix for the dynamic settings of the bushes is not editable. How can I edit this map to use on my own brushes?

You have to define a new paint dynamics. Use the second or third button in the bottom of the Paint Dynamics dockable dialog.

These three points became clear, after I found the mapping-matrix. It was kind of hidden.
This on one hand is a great feature, because you don't have to create a new set of brushes every time you want the brush to fade, scale or turn within one stroke. On the other hand it is quite complicating to use it espacially to new users.

One of my club-members asked me, why the dynamic Off - option is within the list of dynamic options. Mayby it would be a good idea to move the off-option directly on the Tool-Options.

6. The Gimp Tool Options "Smooth stroke" and "Incremental" don't show any affect on the stroke of any brush. Do they only effect brushes using a tablet?

Set the opacity of your brush to 50%, and try it with or without "Incremental" to see what it means.

For "Smooth stroke" try the Paintbrush tool with the Block 01 brush, set the options of Smoot stroke to their maximum, and try with or without checking the option.

Ok, thanks, see the difference, now.

It would be great if you could give me a hint on what I do wrong. Mayby it is a problem with my system (Xubuntu 12.4) I used the packages to compile gimp, shortly after you annouced it.

Your distribution or installation is not important, but these features are new.

Oh, there are the odd one or two differences some times. Like on Windows you can edit any mapping-matrix. On my linux-system I can't. I can only edit selfmade dynamics. And Ubuntu is known to show difficulties with some programs.

Thanks in anyway.

Anke

Anke Lange
An der Landwehr 25
49076 Osnabrck
Telefon 0541 6004299
gimp-werkstatt@gmx.de

www.kreativ-workshops.net
www.gimp-werkstatt.de
www.kompozer-web.de

_______________________________________________
gimp-developer-list mailing list
gimp-developer-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer-list
Martin Renold
2012-05-21 18:12:09 UTC (almost 2 years ago)

Problems with brushes

hi Richard

On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 10:16:01AM -0700, Richard Gitschlag wrote:

"Incremental" means that every application of paint in a stroke layers on top of the previous one. I recommend never using it outside special cases - most brushes have a spacing of 10-15% or so which means that any given pixel along the stroke area will end up 'painted' up to 5-7 times over. Normally this is a moot point but with incremental option this means that the opacity will end up being applied 5-7 times over too -- you lose the ability to get a stroke with a predictable OVERALL opacity value (even an opacity setting of 10%, if incremental, yields an end result up to 40-50% opacity). This is as technically correct as it is utterly undesirable, but it's a limitation in how GIMP handles painting actions internally so it's virtually impossible to fix.

Incremental mode is very useful, especially when painting with a tablet.

It has the advantage that the effect of the brush doesn't depend on whether you have painted over that area already in the same stroke. This makes the stroke more predictable. The sudden change of behaviour of your painting tool at the end of a stroke can be very unnatural. Especially when you try to build up a shade with repeated faint strokes over the same region.

The opacity problem (stroke opacity vs dab opacity) can be fixed mathematically. Grep for OPAQUE_LINEARIZE in the mypaint source code.

Richard Gitschlag
2012-05-22 15:59:18 UTC (almost 2 years ago)

Problems with brushes

Date: Mon, 21 May 2012 20:12:09 +0200 From: martinxyz@gmx.ch
To: strata_ranger@hotmail.com
CC: gimp-developer-list@gnome.org
Subject: Re: [Gimp-developer] Problems with brushes

hi Richard

The opacity problem (stroke opacity vs dab opacity) can be fixed mathematically. Grep for OPAQUE_LINEARIZE in the mypaint source code.

The last time I reported it (bugzilla #588984) I was told "Not A Bug" but also "discuss on mailing list". I did not have access to said mailing list that time ago - but I do now. So yes, let's.

If I set my tool to 50% opacity I want the visible end result of a single (non-overlapping) stroke to be 50% opacity. Whether or not I have incremental mode enabled should make absolutely no difference in this context; it should only make a difference when parts of a stroke overlap or intersect each other (such as shading one area back-and-forth).

-- Stratadrake strata_ranger@hotmail.com
--------------------
Numbers may not lie, but neither do they tell the whole truth.